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9th Wonders Boards > Episode Discussions > Season Two > 2.7: Out of Time
slusho
When Peter had his flashbacks was he reading his Mom's mind, or was she projecting these images into his head Parkman style?

It seems that she might have been the one behind this. Might shed some light on her powers.
Rail24
Maybe it was the Charlie power kicking in.
cloudx
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 09:28 PM) *
When Peter had his flashbacks was he reading his Mom's mind, or was she projecting these images into his head Parkman style?

It seems that she might have been the one behind this. Might shed some light on her powers.



I think that it is more like that is her power. To make people remember things. Kinda like the opposite of the Haitian (spelling?) Perhaps that is why they are friends (as we saw in season 1) because she can undo what he does.
Justin
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 09:28 PM) *
When Peter had his flashbacks was he reading his Mom's mind, or was she projecting these images into his head Parkman style?

It seems that she might have been the one behind this. Might shed some light on her powers.


Peter using Charlie's power. He really wanted to remember stuff out of a desperation, and that's exactly how Charlie got her power. He remember specific images from his lost memory.

What this does show is that the Haitian doesn't actually take memories AWAY, he simply blocks them off, they're still there if you can break through the blocks with a mental power of your own.
Veriandise
The way I took it was that Peter's mind reading ability came out of nowhere, and he was reading her mind. It could be Angela's power, but with the way his powers have been popping up randomly when he needs them, I think it's his.
Femme1986
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 10:28 PM) *
When Peter had his flashbacks was he reading his Mom's mind, or was she projecting these images into his head Parkman style?

It seems that she might have been the one behind this. Might shed some light on her powers.



But, if that were Peter's mother's power, to whom does flying and power absorbtion belong? As noted by a few other characters (i.e. Parkman and Maury, Claire and Adam, etc.), the child receives the same or similar power as had his or her parents. Hmm. mellow.gif
slusho
QUOTE (cloudx @ Nov 5 2007, 09:30 PM) *
I think that it is more like that is her power. To make people remember things. Kinda like the opposite of the Haitian (spelling?) Perhaps that is why they are friends (as we saw in season 1) because she can undo what he does.


I almost wonder if her power is to make people remember whatever she wants them to. Those flashbacks all seemed to revolve around Angela. They were pretty sappy memories.

This would explain why Nathan thinks Peter is dead, because Angela changed his memory.
prander
I tend to also think it was Charlie's enhanced memory power.

If so, this would also strongly suggest that he absorbed all the powers that Sylar stole.
special ability 10
1) first of all, CHILD's POWER are NOWHERE NEAR parents powers, what show have u been watching??

2)peter never MET charlie..
Creator
Good question! I believe she was definitely the sender and Peter was the receiver of the images...the memories. Was it she who was actively sending thoughts by way of her power or was it him receiving her thoughts by way of his power? Interesting!
ColorMeToxic
Or it could just be flashbacks brought on by stress?

LoL. Unlikely for Heroes, but I'm just putting it out there. smile.gif
DannyP
QUOTE (special ability 10 @ Nov 5 2007, 07:34 PM) *
1) first of all, CHILD's POWER are NOWHERE NEAR parents powers, what show have u been watching?

2)peter never MET charlie..


He met Sylar, who just so happened to have Charlie's ability.
fjimenez1
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 10:33 PM) *
I almost wonder if her power is to make people remember whatever she wants them to. Those flashbacks all seemed to revolve around Angela. They were pretty sappy memories.

This would explain why Nathan thinks Peter is dead, because Angela changed his memory.


I was thinking that the memories revolved around her because she was the one pushing him to remember. If she could change memories then that would make her power very similar to the Haitian's
Femme1986
QUOTE (special ability 10 @ Nov 5 2007, 10:34 PM) *
1) first of all, CHILD's POWER are NOWHERE NEAR parents powers, what show have u been watching?

2)peter never MET charlie..



As far as I can tell, Parkman's power = Maury's power (reading minds / various mental abilities, respectively). And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively). Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif
cloudx
QUOTE (Femme1986 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:40 PM) *
As far as I can tell, Parkman's power = Maury's power (reading minds / various mental abilities, respectively). And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively). Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif


wasnt claire Nathans and the fire chicks daughter?
aulduron
What signs lead to Adam being Claires father, instead of Nathan?
Femme1986
QUOTE (cloudx @ Nov 5 2007, 10:42 PM) *
wasnt claire Nathans and the fire chicks daughter?



RIGHT. My bad. huh.gif
But, the Parkman / Maury thing is still true. So, perhaps, some powers are inherited and others are not? What about Bob's statement, then?
I'm confused.
Flymon
i am 100% convinced that it was Peter reading his mothers mind. Angela hadn't seen her son for about a year and had no idea what state he was in. It makes sense that when first seeing him and when trying to get him to remember her so he can trust her that she would think of all the things they did together that were happy memories. They even used the signiture noise that is used that they use when Matt reads minds. As we have learned in this episode that Matts abilities allows him to not only figure out what people are thinking but see what images that are thinking about. This was our first glipse of this part of the ability. At first i doubted this because all the images we saw were from Peter's prespective but if they had shown it from Angelas, it would hav ejust been to confusing. If this was Charlie's ability it wouldn't make any sense that he would only remember his mother. He would have remembered everything including Adam.
Coylej1
QUOTE (Femme1986 @ Nov 5 2007, 07:40 PM) *
As far as I can tell, Parkman's power = Maury's power (reading minds / various mental abilities, respectively). And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively). Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif


One word: Micah
Creator
Justin,

You are assuming that the Haitian is responsible for Peter's memory lost. It may be that Elle is responsible for Peter amnesia. We should find out next week.
boonskank
QUOTE (cloudx @ Nov 5 2007, 09:42 PM) *
wasnt claire Nathans and the fire chicks daughter?


yes. this is just like anything genetic. sometimes the parents have it. sometimes they dont. my sister has curly hair. my mom doesnt. neither does my dad. she could have had straight hair like them or she might not have. some parents have the same abilities of their kids. some dont.

and yes. im pretty sure that was charlie's power kicking in. YAY!
Beez
QUOTE (cloudx @ Nov 5 2007, 10:42 PM) *
wasnt claire Nathans and the fire chicks daughter?



He sure is.
Agent42
QUOTE (Flymon @ Nov 5 2007, 09:44 PM) *
i am 100% convinced that it was Peter reading his mothers mind.


This seems to make the most sense.

What is Angela's power?!
ChidyDog
QUOTE (Femme1986 @ Nov 5 2007, 10:40 PM) *
As far as I can tell, Parkman's power = Maury's power (reading minds / various mental abilities, respectively). And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively). Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif


Did you miss a part of Season 1? All signs regarding Claire's biological family have already been thouroughly explored and revealed in Season 1! Claire's biological father is Nathan, her biological mother is Meredith Gordon (pyro girl, "Nathan's folly in Texas." according to Angela in Season 1), her biological uncle is Peter, her grandmother is Angela, etc. Just because Claire and Adam have similar abilities doesn't mean they're related, at least not as father/daughter anyway. Nathan and West have the same ability (although one is like a supersonic jet and the other is like Peter Pan in their usage of that power) doesn't mean they are related either. Granted the Parkmans have the same power at different levels of develpment, but that doesn't mean every other two people that have the same ability are related. In fact, the Parkmans are the only case of a power being pasted from father to child shown on the series so far.
slusho
QUOTE (Agent42 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:52 PM) *
This seems to make the most sense.

What is Angela's power?!


It has to be something that would allow her to manipulate others. It seems that memory manipulation would be right up her ally. If she's not the one putting these specific memories in Peter's head, she definately had something to do with his recall.
chad13
I definatley think Peter was reading Angela's mind. That's the only real explanation for it (Especially since we don't know Angela's power yet). I doubt (with two "mind readers" already that Angela also would have that power).
prander
QUOTE (special ability 10 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:34 PM) *
1) first of all, CHILD's POWER are NOWHERE NEAR parents powers, what show have u been watching?
As has been said, Matt's power is the same as Maury's (or will advance to be the same).

But most of the powers that the children inherited aren't the same as the parents' powers.

QUOTE
2)peter never MET charlie..
But Sylar stole Charlie's enhanced memory power and then Peter met Sylar. This means it's very possible that Peter absorbed all of Sylar's stolen abilities, including Charlie's enhanced memory power.


QUOTE (fjimenez1 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:36 PM) *
I was thinking that the memories revolved around her because she was the one pushing him to remember.
Along similar lines, I tend to think that she was the only one he really knew / met, so his enhanced memory (from Charlie) could only really be used to remember her, as she was the focus / frame of reference. Her being the focus / frame of reference allowed him to recall his memories.

That's interesting though, as it would indicate that there's a way around the Haitian's memory wiping power... if he did indeed wipe Peter's memory.
boonskank
QUOTE (Agent42 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:52 PM) *
This seems to make the most sense.

What is Angela's power?!


it wasnt him reading her mind. the images he saw included SEEING his mother carrying a cake on his bday. how did she have memories of seeing herself carry a cake towards herself? nope.

super memory.
slusho
QUOTE (boonskank @ Nov 5 2007, 10:13 PM) *
it wasnt him reading her mind. the images he saw included SEEING his mother carrying a cake on his bday. how did she have memories of seeing herself carry a cake towards herself? nope.

super memory.


If it's super memory why did his memories stop at only those of Angela? It seems that he would have been able to expand on each individual memory to rebuild other memories of other people. Instead he was only limited to brief glimpses of one person. This doesn't seem like super memory to me, more like regular old memory.
boonskank
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 10:17 PM) *
If it's super memory why did his memories stop at only those of Angela? It seems that he would have been able to expand on each individual memory to rebuild other memories of other people. Instead he was only limited to brief glimpses of one person. This doesn't seem like super memory to me, more like regular old memory.


possible. but its definitely not mind reading. biggrin.gif
slusho
QUOTE (boonskank @ Nov 5 2007, 10:21 PM) *
possible. but its definitely not mind reading. biggrin.gif


I agree with you based on the "first person" perspective theory. I am still thinking that these "memories" coming to pass has more to do with Angela, than Peter.
boonskank
somewhat unrelated. but i got chills when she told peter he was the most powerful of them all.
Ard_Choille
I think she was deliberately thinking of the images/memories so Peter could use his mind-reading ability. She's been deliberate about her thoughts with Matt on a few occasions so I think she did it again.
RubberDucky
Charlie - no
Mom - no
Charles - no
Sylar - no
Haitian - oh hell yeah

in the comics the Haitian mentioned that the memories he takes are a burdon to him, because they stay with him. not only can he take them away, but he can also give them back to someone. they were always there for Pete because the Haitian didn't fully remove them (just blocked them). some of the memories/flashes were in deed Angela's though, which helped him to bridge that gap. one question remaining is if he now remembers everything (likely not, since he didn't recognize Adam).
aulduron
"That is not the way my gift works"
Flymon
QUOTE (prander @ Nov 5 2007, 11:02 PM) *
Along similar lines, I tend to think that she was the only one he really knew / met, so his enhanced memory (from Charlie) could only really be used to remember her, as she was the focus / frame of reference. Her being the focus / frame of reference allowed him to recall his memories.


This doesn't hold true. He saw a picture of Nathan. By this logic he would have remembered him when he saw his picture. as i already posted i am pretty sure all the shots where of Angela because if all we saw was shots of Peter as a child and so forth it wouldn't have made any sense to the watcher. I think this was done just to make the average Hero's watcher understand he was remeber things about his mother.

Although i do think peter has Charlie's ability i really dont think this was it here.
ppthenuke
In a comic con last year the writers already said Peter has all of Sylars powers. Go find it cause I won't. But its there.
prander
QUOTE (slusho @ Nov 5 2007, 10:17 PM) *
If it's super memory why did his memories stop at only those of Angela? It seems that he would have been able to expand on each individual memory to rebuild other memories of other people.
I think it's because since he had amnesia, he needed her as a focus / frame of reference. He didn't remember anyone else, so his super memory allowed him to only access his memories of her.

QUOTE
Instead he was only limited to brief glimpses of one person. This doesn't seem like super memory to me, more like regular old memory.
But his "regular old memory" is nothing but complete amnesia, that's why it would seem to be his "super memory".


QUOTE (Flymon @ Nov 5 2007, 10:34 PM) *
This doesn't hold true. He saw a picture of Nathan. By this logic he would have remembered him when he saw his picture. as i already posted i am pretty sure all the shots where of Angela because if all we saw was shots of Peter as a child and so forth it wouldn't have made any sense to the watcher. I think this was done just to make the average Hero's watcher understand he was remeber things about his mother.

Although i do think peter has Charlie's ability i really dont think this was it here.
With the way I'm thinking of it, it does hold true. Peter just didn't use the power then and, further, being with his mom in person allowed him to access the memories. That's different, as I see it, from looking at a photograph.


QUOTE (RubberDucky @ Nov 5 2007, 10:31 PM) *
some of the memories/flashes were in deed Angela's though, which helped him to bridge that gap.
I think this could be a part of how his enhanced memory works, he has to make some sort of "connection" with the person.

QUOTE
one question remaining is if he now remembers everything (likely not, since he didn't recognize Adam).
I think his enhanced memory is used selectively in that he doesn't just remember everything he ever knew, he has to "focus" on something to "recall it to the front". I think the enhanced memory allows him to access all his memories, but still selectively... no different, in that sense, than normal memory.
aulduron
Angela, having experience with telepaths, may have been "thinking loudly" so Peter would read their shared memories
psyfect
I really don't think the writers would (unknowingly?) insult our intelligence by changing the perspective to 'make it easier to understand.' I would have understood loud and clear if I saw some scenes from her point of view; i.e. bending down to give him a kiss on his x# birthday, another shot of her dropping him off for his first day of school, etc.

I think if he read her mind he wouldn't have been so emotional, he probably would have just thought "Ok, so this must be my mom." Remember that Matt's power is sort of like 'I am aware these are not my thoughts.' The first time Matt read a mind I believe he asked the person something like 'What did you say?'

What we witnessed was more like him reliving a part of his life. Eidetic memory anyone?
VentiDeMilo
QUOTE (Justin @ Nov 5 2007, 10:30 PM) *
Peter using Charlie's power. He really wanted to remember stuff out of a desperation, and that's exactly how Charlie got her power. He remember specific images from his lost memory.

What this does show is that the Haitian doesn't actually take memories AWAY, he simply blocks them off, they're still there if you can break through the blocks with a mental power of your own.



Good theory. And because other people don't have Charlie's power, they can't recall the memories. Peter has Charlie's power, he can recall tongue.gif

As I said, it's a good theory..but not sure if it's correct. I think this is yet another topic that will be debated to eternity and still have no right/wrong answers tongue.gif
Triggar23
Anyone ever think of Edens power of suggestion?
In Heroes all powers are not exactly alike. But while he was having flashbacks she was telling him to remember. Maybe it's the power of persuasion or mind control. But something similar to Eden but not the same. He only remembered her though.
VentiDeMilo
Just to add...

Looks like next week, Adam will help Peter to recall what happened 4 months ago..and maybe Peter will get all of his memories back afterward smile.gif
meijiOrO
I don't think that he was reading Angela's mind since Matt told his wife last season that he can't see thoughts only hear them.
fernajen
QUOTE (Flymon @ Nov 5 2007, 11:34 PM) *
This doesn't hold true. He saw a picture of Nathan. By this logic he would have remembered him when he saw his picture.



Not necessarily, there are some differences between the two situations. When he is faced with the picture of Nathan he still isn't sure he wants to know his past and lets face it pictures don't talk back, show affection to, or feel hurt by lack of recognition, so he not feeling that much pressure to remember him. Him meeting his mother on the hand she greets with a hug, that he doesn't reciprocate instead pulling away and saying something around the lines of we each other? I can't imagine that it would feel all that great to have your child look at as though you are a complete stranger, Peter probably could pick up some sense of this hurt even though he has no idea who she is. Then she describes him as a (I'm paraphrasing here) very kind and selfless person which to a certain degree would dispel some of his fears about himself.
Godpleaser07
QUOTE (cloudx @ Nov 5 2007, 09:30 PM) *
I think that it is more like that is her power. To make people remember things. Kinda like the opposite of the Haitian (spelling?) Perhaps that is why they are friends (as we saw in season 1) because she can undo what he does.

Exactly what I was thinking!
URAINAH
But Matt's power is evolving to projecting thoughts, and creating visual thoughts like Maury. Still haven't quite figured out Angela's powers yet. I know that she can tell when someone is "special" and can recognize their ability. She does say things in a very persuasive way i.e. Eden, but people don't respond as obediently to her. Perhaps Peter was using Charlie's power to some extent. We haven't seen her powers really used since Sylar killed her, except in the GN with Sylar (sorry if I can't remember any more specific moments). And it would be nice to see a part of Charlie survive.
MP3
QUOTE (Femme1986 @ Nov 5 2007, 09:40 PM) *
As far as I can tell, Parkman's power = Maury's power (reading minds / various mental abilities, respectively). And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively). Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif


I don't know that that specifically points to Adam being Claire's dad. I think Nathan is still her real father. So far Parkman's the only one that's inherited his parent's powers..but who knows! =D

QUOTE (Godpleaser07 @ Nov 5 2007, 11:25 PM) *
Exactly what I was thinking!



Same! I just assumed it was because I have more faith in the writers than to accept that Peter just suddenly pulled the thoughts out of thin air. Has to be something with his mom.
TrentSteele
QUOTE (Femme1986 @ Nov 5 2007, 07:40 PM) *
And, all signs lead to Adam being Claire's father, whose powers are very similar (the ability to heal / the ability to regenerate, respectively).

blink.gif We've known since last spring that Nathan is Claire's biological father(in no unequivocal terms, straight from the mother, grandmother, and Nathan himself), and Tim Kring has stated publicly that right from the time he first drew up character outlines he had planned for Nathan to be Claire's father. There is not a single sign given in the plot that would point to Adam being Claire's father, other than their shared power, which is obviously an argument in a circle(if you're trying to present evidence that children inherit the same powers as their parents, then use Adam and Claire as an example, and when asked how you know they're father and son, say "because they have the same power," you're using a circular argument, which is a logical fallacy). And Nathan and Claire certainly have much different powers.

QUOTE
Also, Bob did say to Parkman that he could do anything his father could do. And, he did.

Yes, but Parkman is the only character we know of to have inherited his father's power.

QUOTE
We don't know all the powers of the various original Heroes, so I don't know if this holds true for every one of the Heroes (this would be hard, given how many there are), but that's the evidence I've seen, thus far. smile.gif

No, actually, we do know- it doesn't. Micah obviously doesn't have the same power as D.L.(unless you're going to argue that Niki went out and cheated with some other black guy who just so happened to have technology-controlling powers, which still doesn't work, since we know D.L. is Micah's father from the whole elaborate life-map thing Linderman had of them). Claire doesn't have the same power as Nathan(who is her biological father). Niki's father certainly didn't seem to have any kind of power. And if Maya and Alejandro's parents had had the same powers as they do, I think they'd be aware. The "same-powers-as-parents" theory absolutely does not hold water.
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