I was really happy to see Peter making smart choices and using his flight power very effectively, so that he seemed powerful even though most of his powers are blocked. I thought he was screwed when the Hunter's goons went after him at Primatech but he used the flash grenade and escaped! Awesome. Also, he managed to save Matt.

On the other hand, Peter is definitely not as empathetic as he used to be. He didn't seem to feel HRG's pain when he was getting tortured and callously told Matt to continue (okay, maybe it was the right call, but it didn't feel like Peter). And he used to be fairly close to him too, because of Claire. And he did shoot the Hunter in the arm. Maybe after killing his dad, hurting people isn't so hard for him? Also, I thought he would do more to help defuse the tension between Matt and Mohinder. He didn't seem to feel for Matt, even with Daphne probably (as far as they knew) dead and only said "try not to kill each other", acting annoyed with them. He has been betrayed too often, I guess, and now he doesn't connect with people in the same way.

Anyway, seeing as his power is empathy and all, I'm thinking he'll have to learn to trust and care about people again if he wants to hold more powers. I know the problem could probably be solved by some kind of Sylar or Ando contact, but I doubt the writers will go the "technical" route to him getting his powers back--it will have to be some emotional journey.

Well the whole thing can be explained now as "he had no empathic mimicry anymore" and that his power absorbion ability is just that and has nothing to do with empathy anymore.

I think that they mainly went this way in overall so that peter can change the way you saw him change showing that actually his empathy was more a treat of his power then himself being such a person.

Works for the story they wanna tell but as you said its out of character
The reason why? Because they confirmed themselves a long time ago that the naturals powers are based on how the person is and peter was always a caring person no matter if with power or without.

Out of character?

He's been through more hell in less than 2 years than most people deal with in a lifetime. I think him being "flashburned" so to speak is completely in character.

As far as the new power having any weight on his personality? Unlikely. He still cares, deeply, but he also knows that things he may not like need done in order for the world not to go to hell.

I recommend rewatching it, because you saw something completely different in it than I did. I saw a Peter who still cared, who still let his emotions think for him a lot, but was also (finally) growing up.

I know what he is been through. No need to remind me.
Fact is that he would never approve "torture" and would rather act the way mohinder rather did than the way they showed him doing.
It's obvious that they are trying to make him more "badass" and such but at the cost of the character at the end.
Don't get me wrong, I like him now more even I dislike the one power thingy that they already contradicted in this episode when he were able all of sudden to carry matt and still be able to fly.
However, to me it seems as if they are going like as if his empathic side got lost together with his old ability and I think that they are doing it this way so the "new mechanism" they added into the character can actually work.
This seems then to be going again the same way as other things we had previously: Good Thought, Bad Execution!
Makes me think that they don't learn out of their mistakes. :/

Well... let's see what comes our way. Maybe they will surprise us a bit after all.

I'm so used to us disagreeing by now that it doesn't surprise me here either. lol
I don't see it as a cost to the character at all. I see it as the next step- he's closer to F_Peter from 5YG here, which is what people have been wanting since we first saw him.
What they were doing to Noah made perfect sense, even from an emotion-based thought process.
It wasn't exactly torture. (Was there a little pain? Perhaps. But far less than even a typical, within Geneva conventions, interrogation.)
They were rounding up Specials. No trial. No contact. Just *pooWaffles and they're gone. Peter had already been on the receiving end of it once and knew it was going to happen again. They needed the information to find out how to stop it. And using the drugs and Matt's ability was the only way to get that info without hurting someone.
And if they didn't have that information? Everyone, at best, vanishes. At worst, and most likely, everyone dies.


I don't get the contradiction. Unless you're assuming it's an "always on" ability- which the thing in the plane already proved it wasn't. (Otherwise he'd have reabsorbed Mohinder's ability when he touched him.)
Not that it matters, since Matt was almost completely covered in that jumpsuit.


And we're back to opinion difference again. lol

Heh, would have been funny if halfway through flying Matt away Peter accidentally absorbed his ability and dropped out of the sky. XD

I know you love me, I love you too!


Contradiction more of his behaviour than the execution of the interrogation.
Mohinder stood there being worried about Noahs condition while Peter didn't gave a (you know what...) doesn't look like peter at all.
By that I don't mean mohinder being afraid that the others find out that noah had approached him before cause even after this one was out and known, he still cares.
As about 5yg: different future, different character is all I can say!
People can change over time. Some basic touches of ones characters though is always there and in peters case its his caring.


I meant when he left Tracy back cause he could do the same if it wouldn't cause him to lose the flight and regain the temperature alteration ability.

In the plane it looked as if he could gain a power from someone once and after he loses it to a other power, he can't regain the previous ability from the previous person again since he probably (or rather obviously?) couldn't regain mohinders ability.

If that would be really the case then he could had touches tracy without problems though he states to her that when he gets a power he loses a other one to her(not the exact words..).

If however this shouldn't be the case and he was actually afraid that by touching her he would get her ability again and lose flight, then it wouldn't make sense to touch matt and fly.

As about the clothes/jumpsuit comment: Tracy had some clothes on aswell.

Yippie!

yes, but correct me if I am wrong, he had physical contact with tracy's hand which was not covered by any sort of clothing. so long as he doesn't touch Matt's skin he is in the clear. Or rather that is what I assume

I'm with Synch on this! WOW!!

You can tell just by his voice that he is becoming future Peter. I saw an interview with Milo about how the voice and confident walk were some of the things he focused on when he was acting as future Peter. That's what he is becoming now. The fact that he was willing to kill Arthur shows he is becoming more...actually less naive. He knows since he saved Nathan that not everyone he cares for feels the same in return, and it's gonna end with him being hurt.

He is evolving into future Peter, no doubt.

I have a suspicion that Peter could get his old power back if he becomes the more optimistic Peter he was in the first series..

I find myself agreeing with pretty much everyone, since I don't think we're really that far apart. Peter has become more callous, but he has every reason to. He didn't like that Noah was being tortured, but he felt betrayed by him and that made it legitimate in his eyes. Peter is definitely undergoing some serious change - he has seen so much betrayal on such a personal level recently that he's trying to ward himself off from too many connections. Yes, it's totally out of character - and totally understandable, at least for me. I've seen it happen to people.

Peter has a brain, Sylar has more heart lately (not killing Martin, taking Luke as his apprentice) and Hiro wanting to be a hero without powers shows he has no end of courage.

My question is: who is Dorothy?

We've seen Peter can absorb through clothing and I doubt they'd make it a rule that skin contact makes absorbtion mandatory but a cotton shirt makes it optional.

Where have we seen that Peter absorbs through clothing?

In the instances we've known him to absorb something, there was always skin involved, or it's safe to assume that some incidental skin contact was established.

1) Grabbing Nathan to fly away: He must have touched him somewhere. Here we actually have to conjecture.

2) Grabbing Mohinder's hand on the plane.

3) Accidentally knocking into Tracy on the plane. She had her hands uncovered by that time, and he tried to catch himself on her armrest.

4) Absorbing flight from Nathan while threatening him with a gun - he hand his hand on Nathan's neck.

I think it is clear that Peter can control if he takes a Power or not, the one time he took Tracy's Power was maybe an accident, he was focused on fighting the guards and under stress.

He also took Nathans Power just before he flew away, you can see it beacuse of the special effect. If he hadn't any control over it he would have taken it as soon as he touched him.

Well, it would have been safer to absorb it as soon as he pulled Nathan towards him. But not as suspenseful.

Otherwise, I agree with you 100%.

I can't tell whether Peter is surprised in A Clear and Present Danger (more detail here) but I'm pretty sure he is only touching clothing in Trust and Blood.

Agreed. It's pretty clear what the case is if anyone goes back and watches A Clear and Present Danger. He's holding onto Nathan for a good while before he absorbs flight from Nathan and flies away. And it's clear that he can take a power back after gaining another since he flew when he first got his powers back and took it back in a Clear and Present Danger.

after watching and pausing. you can see that peter does not have skin contact with nathan. However, he does not instantly take his powers upon touching him. so there is some kind of conscious thought that is put into it, at least under normal circumstances.

I do think they have sacrificed a bit of Peter's empathy but not to a point where is has destroyed the character. He already seems to have cut himself off emotionally to an extent and with his touch-based power physcial contact is something that has been brought down to a minmum. He obviously still had a great big heart and feels responsible for those around him but his emotions are just more guarded now.

As for the holding Matt and still flying, it crossed my mind that they contradicted themselves but I do believe that skin-to-skin contact is required for him to absorb an ability. Peter has never absorbed through clothing that we have been shown. So it's plausible that he could fly without touching skin.

He can touch people without immediately absorbing their abilities. He has to make a conscious choice. The only exception to this is Tracy on the plane, but that was probably because a.) he was scared b.) he didn't fully understand his new power yet and c.) plot device!

I agree with everything you said, but I don't like using the term "out of character" here. It's a logical development of his character.

I was just picking up the term - I wouldn't have called it that either.

How can you say "fact is"? Future Peter had/has the same powers as present Peter and he shot his own Brother, tortured individuals, and was an all around badass. There is no fact there, Peter is simply evolving and I don't see how this can be shown to take away from his empathy. His powers are similar to his fathers and his previous powers. Just because they have altered somewhat does not mean that he is no longer empathetic. What Nathan is doing is wrong and sometimes the end justifies the means.

I agree that this is a natural progression of the character. Everytime we've seen F_Peter it has been 4-5 years in the future. We have NO idea what happened in those years so there's no way to say what did or did not happen to him. Maybe he WAS so powerful and Bad ****** like that because he lost the ability to get multipler powers. Maybe his powers becoming just about touch is ALWAYS the way it happened, we don't know. Sylar is tapping into the more empathic nature of his ability while Peter isn't. Yin/Yang.

Anyways, I came on this thread to see what everything thought about Peter using the flying ability so well in this episode. One thought that just keeps popping into my head is in the first season, Nathan and PEter are talking (this is the scene when Nathan tells Peter he was almost abducted by Noah and The Haitian) Nathan looked down at his ability and said something to the effect of "I can fly, what am I supposed to do? Save kittens from trees" Peter, this episode, showed Nathan just how much you can do with a simple ability and a brain.

Raid a locker full of information and guns? Check. Get surrounded by army prepared for you with one way in, one way out and STILL get away? Check. Stop Noah from escaping when he was in a room with a friggin MIND READER and SUPERSTRENGTH? Check. Then, he used the flying ability to fly up to Danko's room and get the drop on him. "You really should lock your windows"

Nathan seriously underestimated his power from the very beginning and I feel if he had embraced it like Peter and used it to do the things that might seem trivial at the time (Saving kittens? lol) he would've appreciated the powers more. Thoughts?

Weren't people making the same arguments for Arthur? That he was touching people without stealing there powers. Then we learned that he he chooses to take powers, and it takes a while.


I don't think he underestimates his abilities, I just think he doesn't like them much. Sort of a hypocrite. He has used his powers offensively a couple of times. I just think Nathan does things for a price. There's no power/money in saving kittens, and people. What if the people turn on you, and want to burn you has a witch?

My thought is I agree. Nathan is right literally but wrong in principle. He is literally right that a flying man can't do much to solve the world's problems on his own. Example: Peter is doing awesome stuff with flight in this episode but none of it is exactly curing cancer. But Nathan is also wrong. Working with the right people (HEBs or otherwise) Nathan could do great things with his ability. Example: Nathan helped save New York and helped save 90% of the human race. Nathan just doesn't get what Peter, Hiro and Rachel Dawes do. It's not what your abilities are that count, it's how you use them.

Peter began by trusting everyone and to be more effective had to learn distrust. Nathan will never get anywhere that satisfies him until he learns to trust.

People can also change almost immediately, given the right circumstances. And when that change happens, they're completely unrecognizable to how they were. I've seen it happen in real life, which is probably why I don't have the problem you and some others do with Peter.

It's Rachel Mills not Rachel Dawes. Rachel Dawes is Batman's girlfriend lol I've almost done that a few times . I don't think she's fully on board yet though. In the latest iStory she obviously thinks of the people they're rounding up as freaks and is trying to ignore Rebel's messages.

Anyway, I completely agree with your post as a whole.

No, it's Rachel Dawes. As far as I can tell Rachel Mills doesn't get it any more than Nathan does.

Who is Rachel Dawes? I couldn't find her on HeroesWiki? Was she on the show? I'm confused.

She doesn't exist in the Heroesverse. lol

That's what I thought! lol

Ok, I just reread Shader's comment (for the umpteenth time) and I think he may have been joking

Synch, I almost didn't recognize you without the Kristin Belle photos.

"It isn't who you are inside, it's what you do that defines you."
--Rachel Dawes in Batman Begins

So no, it wasn't a joke.

"It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." ~Dumbledore, book 2.

Yeah. I'm a geek.

"Lois Lane realizes she should have known it was a fake. For it is not his powers that make him Superman. Nor is it his wisdom. It is his will to use that power and wisdom in the service of all life."
--Paraphrased from memory of an old Superman comic book

Yeah. I'm geekier.

Touche`....

Let's try to stay on topic here.

I think Peter's personality has changed in a believable way. He's been through a lot, and now his own brother, who he loves dearly, is hunting not only him, but all specials. He's still the caring empathic guy, but right now he has a big situation to deal with. While he cares, he knows he has to get things done to save everyone. Someone's got to stop Nathan. He still cares.

With Noah being interrogated, Peter was concerned if it had to hurt to get the information. He agreed with Matt that they needed to get the information, so he let Matt do what was necessary. Mohinder's concern was Matt finding out that Noah had previously told Mohinder about the government. Plus, I wouldn't put the pain from the interrogation on level with other methods of torture. The point in this case wasn't to torture the information, but to allow Matt to read it from Noah's mind. Peter wanted to get the information while causing as little harm as he could.

Later we see Peter, approach Danko, and actually shoot him. I think the whole having to shoot his father thing last volume has affected Peter's approach to things. Peter knows that Danko is leading this operation, and thinks that stopping him would also stop everyone from being hunted. It's a tough choice for Peter. He just wants to do what's best for everyone. Ultimately Peter does choose not to kill Danko, partly at least so the government wouldn't turn from from capturing to killing, but I think deep down Peter didn't want to take a life either.

I think the change in Peter is believable and it hasn't felt awkward or forced to me. If Peter was still open and trusting after everything that has happened to him I would find that unbelievable. I think this needs to happen. Peter had to turn into some variation of 5YG Peter eventually.

Although I personally miss Peter's puppy eyed expressions (or is that just me? ) I can see why he would be in his determined, tunnel-vision mode in "Cold Wars."

Peter's obviously losing his faith in humanity. He was really annoyed with Matt and Mohinder's fighting and when Matt told Peter "it's your brother!" he looked wounded and defensive. He's still dealing with Nathan's betrayal.

I think a lot of what defines Peter and Nathan's personalities is their relationship to eachother (which is interesting since you don't see that in real life between siblings with such a big age difference.) Like Nathan said in S1: "Who am I without you?....A lot of who we are is who people expect us to be." Peter's supposed to be the yin to Nathan's yang, so to speak. They wouldn't be in character if they didn't care about eachother. I think they're both feeling lost now.

Oh.....Another point I meant to make before. I think Peter's whole losing-faith-in-humanity is why his synth ability isn't functioning properly.

Here's a quote from BTE:

"“I have a question about Peter. So far, both the natural and synthetic powers all manifest themselves in terms of both need and personality. Peter's powers were originally empathic in nature. Which makes sense, him being a hospice care worker. Why did Peter regain the ability to absorb other abilities yet only through touch, and even then, only one power at a time? Is it a meta-message, like in the movie ‘Crash,’ where the idea that all humans crave contact and comfort and Peter provides that? It's also interesting to note, it's also a variation on Arthur's ability, only Peter copies and doesn't steal.”

It is interesting. You’re on to something Louis. Peter needed to reconnect with his empathy. Something he’s been sorely lacking since this adventure began. Maybe this is the universe telling him he needs to go back to his old ways. "

linkie-link: http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=20086

So yes, Peter does need to reconnect with himself. If you really want to have this idea beaten into your skull go read any of Creator's threads in the Speculation section.

I think Nathan hates the idea of not being normal. He would hate Peter's power even more if he had it, deep down. Nathan wants to be everything he is because of himself, he had his life neatly planned out, and this whole flying thing messed up his entire life. If these powers had never happened to him, he'd be a much more content man.

I know what you mean cause I witnessed this aswell and I have been through some changes myself aswell. However, even we change in some terms, deep inside us there are always pieces of our old selfs and some "touches" of our personalities always stay no matter what happens in life.

As about the other comments that would be too many to quote:

- Peter absorbed flight from nathan over the clothes and that proves that he doesn't need skin contact (even it sounds and looks weird but ok...).

If he could selectively absorb a power like arthur then he could have taken tracy with him without problems. If not, then it was a contradiction that he were able to carry matt without getting his power.

- the future references
I think that we all should keep in mind that 5yg, the virus future and the last shown "everyone has and uses a ability" future will never happen. Due to this peter CAN'T turn exactly the same way as he was there and because of this they obviously dropped the scar that they will probably not let happen anymore either. Due to all this the character can now change to whatever since the future that's about to unfold is build on the current happenings that are not related with any other of the futures we saw before.

- Nathan
I think that this season Nathan will finally gonna get it and probably be the one that will have to leave the series cause his character reaches its end (through his doings) for sure.

However.. I kinda thing that they are probably preparing Peters departure rather so it's more a wait and see situation right now.

What I enjoy the most though in Nathans case is that he starts to see how wrong everything goes and what a big mistake he has done AGAIN.

I guess Mommy will have to show him the way this time cause she definately told him before but he didn't wanted to listen. Those who doesn't listen have to feel right?

Now it seems that Danko will make him feel, Peter already does, Tracy already did and probably will do again and Angela will for sure too.

I think the storyline this time was built up good and I hope they won't break it in the middle so the quality can remain and the series has a chance to glance again.

I don't think it's intentional but actually most of the "artificials" don't seem too happy about having powers - maybe because it's against their nature? You already pointed out Nathan. Tracy also seeks for a normal life, same for Niki. Who else has/ had synthetic powers?

Mohinder - he looks happy enough now he's got rid of the scales

peter seems to still be an empathetic person...just because he's not acting on that personality trait 24/7 is just a sign that he's matured.

if he didn't have empathy for others, he wouldn't have the job he currently has. if he didn't feel for others, he wouldn't still be struggling the way he does over his brother's betrayal.

i should point out that even very cruel people can be empathic, such as sylar.

empathy only implies that you can glean emotional states or put yourself in other people's shoes very easily.

peter still seems capable of both.

Ando and Mohinder are neither miserable or overjoyed with their abilities but they injected themselves so that influences how they feel about it.

But based on the DC going boom painting it's looking more and more like some version of the bad future is inevitable. They just keep avoiding it.

As for Peter not taking Tracy with him that was because she almost gave him up. If she had a real chance to she would have exchanged Peter for her normal life back. Peter saw this and left her there. Why team up with someone who is only looking out for themselves and almost betrayed him? Peter has been betrayed many times before so he's a little sick of it. I think Tracy's a fairly interesting character with potential so it's not out of hate I say I would have abandoned her to

Peter can touch people without automatically absorbing their ability. He held Nathan for awhile in "Trust and Blood" before absorbing his ability.

And if you say "almost" there, it's only because Peter acted before she could betray him. She would have, and they all knew it. I'm not sure it was her plan from the very beginning, she was probably waiting for things to unfold until she placed her bid, but her first idea on the phone was selling Peter to Nathan in exchange for her old life.

I think Tracy sparked the least amount of empathy in Peter actually. Especially after she said "I know how Nathan thinks. I think the same way." The scene so far where Peter acts the least like himself is when Tracy is telling him how nervous she is and thinks her power won't work and he basically tells her to suck it up lol. That's also the scene where Peter says Nathan isn't his brother anymore.




Not to get even more off topic, but I don't think selling Peter out was her original plan. I think Peter was in on the original plan. But once she saw the tides changing in her favour she didn't hesitate to give Peter up.

Well, she was talking to Nathan while Peter was a good distance away, which suggested to me that he wasn't in on her ideas at that point.

And I pretty much agree that Tracy was not a person to whom Peter could relate in the beginning, leaving aside whether she planned to sell him out later or not. She was a familiar face while he was on the run, and he's still got his "saving people thing" (as Hermione Granger puts it), and he knew they would be better off together than fending for themselves.